Ordinariate Stats question

Someone working on an article sent me a question on the numbers of priests ordained for ministry in the three Ordinariates.

The figures he had are: OLW: 110 TCSP: 50 OLSC: 25.

Would anyone knowledgeable be able to confirm or correct these figures?

Thanks!

 

 

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12 Responses to Ordinariate Stats question

  1. CatholicLeft says:

    It depends on the question – I have 54 priests for COSP but some were already ordained under the Pastoral Provision (for instance, Fr Bergman).
    I will have a bit of a shufty and see what I can calculate.

  2. The figure normally given for OLW is closer to 85, Deborah.

    • Rev22:17 says:

      David,

      You wrote: The figure normally given for OLW is closer to 85, Deborah.

      I don’t know the exact number, but I recently saw a published statement that the Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham has as many clergy as a typical Catholic diocese in the United Kingdom.

      Of course, the Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham has a lot fewer laity than a typical Catholic Diocese in the United Kingdom — but that probably will change in due course.

      Norm.

      • EPMS says:

        The Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham has a lot fewer laity than a typical Catholic parish, actually, and that probably won’t change “in due course” because that is not its current trajectory. Active leadership and planning are required if the situation is to improve.

      • Rev22:17 says:

        EPMS,

        You wrote: The Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham has a lot fewer laity than a typical Catholic parish, actually…

        I’m not so sure of that. There are many parishes in rural areas, at least here in North America, that have perhaps a couple hundred parishioners and only one service — perhaps frequently the Rite of Celebration of Sunday in the Absence of a Priest led by a either permanent deacon or a competent lay person on Sundays when the pastor is elsewhere — on a Sunday. Here, I’m talking about situations in which one presbyter is simultaneously pastor of several parishes, and simply cannot get to all of them for mass every weekend. I’m not convinced that such situations are not so commonplace in the great American (and Canadian) heartland as to constitute a majority of parishes in North America.

        You continued: … and that probably won’t change “in due course” because that is not its current trajectory.

        The ordinariate’s membership is growing through new receptions as well as baptisms, etc., and it does not have significant numbers of members who are falling away due to lack of personal commitment. By contrast, many parishes and dioceses that serve mostly “culturally Catholic” populations are generally still in a state of serious decline. An organization that sustains growth will always become larger than an organization that’s in decline sooner or later, though it may take a while if both the rate of growth and the rate of decline are small relative to the difference in size.

        Norm.

  3. EPMS says:

    The website of OLSC gives contact information for 15 clergy, including the Ordinary, serving 11 communities.

    • Rev22:17 says:

      EPMS,

      You wrote: The website of OLSC gives contact information for 15 clergy, including the Ordinary, serving 11 communities.

      Yes, but with more in or preparing for formation.

      Does anybody have a count on the clergy of the Church of the Torres Strait who are coming into the Ordinariate of Our Lady of the Southern Cross?

      Norm.

      • EPMS says:

        The webpage of the CTS gives the total population of the Torres Strait Islands as around 4,000. Hard to know what percentage of these are current ACCA members. There are 16 parishes listed. As the population is distributed over many small communities some of these may be “points” served by the same clergyman. Inevitably not all members will seek reception in the Catholic church. In North America perhaps half the clergy and 20% of the laity of the TAC bodies were received.

  4. EPMS says:

    Norm, regarding your post of 5:10pm: the phrase was “typical Catholic parish”, and I would stand by the assertion that a typical parish has several thousand members, although the exceptional parish may have fewer. And the Ordinary of the OOLW expressed his disappointment, in May of this. year, at the lack of growth. The membership figure of 1,500 has been pretty constant. Of course there have been receptions and baptisms, but we have also read that some groups have “hemorrhaged” membership to diocesan parishes. Inevitably members are dying, and a few no doubt have returned to the Cof E. The demographic is largely elderly, as is evident if you work your way through the group photos on the OOLW website. So there is no reason to be complacent that growth is somehow inevitable, just because the Ordinariate escapes the complacency of “culltural Catholicism”. Which might come in the next generation anyway.

    • Rev22:17 says:

      EPMS,

      You wrote: … the phrase was “typical Catholic parish”, and I would stand by the assertion that a typical parish has several thousand members, although the exceptional parish may have fewer.

      What is prevalent in your (or my) personal experience is not necessarily what is “typical.” There are a LOT of Catholic parishes in rural America with less than a few hundred parishioners — and most of these parishes are well off the beaten track where even a tourist or traveler would not be likely to visit them.

      Here, it’s important to remember that a “typical parish” is not necessarily the same as the parish to which a “typical Catholic parishioner” belongs. It would take ten rural parishes with a couple hundred parishioners each to serve as many baptized faithful as one urban or suburban parish with a couple thousand parishioners — so if the actual ratio is five rural parishes per urban/suburban parish, the “typical parish” is a rural parish of perhaps a couple hundred parishioners but the “typical Catholic parishioner” worships in an urban or suburban parish with a couple thousand parishioners.

      I should also point out that a count of active parishioners might tell a very different story. Many diocesan parishes have very large numbers of official members who are no longer observant, whereas nearly all of the ordinariate’s laity are actively living out their faith.

      • EPMS says:

        Norm, we’re beating this to death, but what the heck. Fifteen percent of Catholic parishes in the US have fewer than 200 households, down from 24 percent in 2000. So these parishes are not typical.

  5. godfrey1099 says:

    1. In a very recent study on convert clergy in the UK by Linda Woodhead, the exact number of 87 “former Anglican priests in the Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham” was provided. Msgr Newton has also mentioned “more than eighty” repeatedly.
    2. The number for OCSP seems to be more than 50, but – judging by your splendid and revealing interview with Msgr Steenson – you are more in a position to check it out and give us the exact number, than the other way round 😉

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